Hmmm.... but Hiake, your answer is almost the same as believing in a Divine Presence. Both of which are intangible and cannot be explained logically. Viewing from a third person view (neither pro/ cons atheist, christianity, etc...), one can categorize both as invalid, would it not? If i understood what you meant, does it imply that humans are products of the big bang theory or evolution? @ vintage. You believe that we are related to chimps? And possibly their descendants?
In fact I don't think it cannot be explained logically, it just cannot be TESTED logically because we have no way in altering the universe/environment we live in (at the level where the Earth would turn a different way or something or a different climate/chemical pattern). However, seeing how we always say "wow, the way this person drives, an accident is emminent" <- yet not every person described by this particular sentiment had experienced a traffic accident. The notion of "the world is perfect for human" is an observation from hindsight... But anyways. And I do think chimps are related to humans... Like how apples are related to tomatos...
That puts your theory 0, Religion 1. If you have the time, go interview religious ppl (minus the fanatics of course) who have experienced a love / life changing emotions in their lives. They switched from one extreme to another (ie: violent to peaceful). This would imply that there is a superior being out there watching out after us, would it not? And no, its not a fabrication of the feeble minded attempting to explain their confused emotions or thoughts. Interesting concept you got there. Can you explain how some chimps stayed as what they are and we as we have become? Chances and coincidences as answers are not accepted -smart
According to the bible, god is love. Whether or not you believe love or hate exist is up to you. I am not sure if emotions can be explained logically (for example, if 100 people had the same type of hardships in their life there may be 100 different type of reactions). My question is before the earth was created, do you believe emotions existed or did the birth of emotions began when the earth began?
wat the hell are u guys talkinga bout. . i believe emotions exists as long as there were creatures out there with the capacity to experience emotions. If such creatures existed before earth began, then yes. elsewise no. I believe that all emotions caused by instinctual urges. Love is just part of our instincts that makes us reproduce and take care of our offspring to continue our race. sad but i believe this to be true.
Is it necessary that a superior being changed their emotions? Watching out after believers eh? One of these days I may be able to use this argument to convince a believer to test God's power by lying on a railway track in use. Anyways, I would think that believers had something (namely, religion and God) that they can appeal their negative feelings to, thus ridding themselves from those negative feeling. I can do the same with my divine salt shaker (some people do it with their diary) but it didn't make my divine salt shaker nor some people's diary superior or beyond human understanding. It's just a tool to get rid of negative feeling, some people don't even NEED a concrete object to do it. Miracle? I don't think so. The same way apples came from rose. And really, RELATED doesn't mean every single one of the former group would become part of the latter group... Case in point: Children and adults are RELATED, and CHILDREN are descended from adults, WHY IS THERE STILL CHILDREN? If the entire population of Chimps evolved into human, the competition would be too fierce (remember, that's before human have agricultural revolution) and a lot of humans would die. That's why there are chimps which remained chimps and maintain the niche and lineage.
I know this is really off topic but I saw a video on youtube of a ninja monkey, around 15 seconds it looks like he's break dancing [youtube]YnA3Vkrf8wA[/youtube]
^Then why do you post it in this thread of all places? Maybe you could relate to the topic by arguing that the ninja monkey is able to break dance - > Miracle -> believe in God?
oh this is not that hard of a question actually, just gimme a couple of million dollars and a college degree and said god gave it to you, i will believe then no doubt haha....
humans evovled with a bigger brain and it wasn't the chimps who were our competition, there were Neanderthals and other forms of early humans.
The Superior Being didnt change their emotions, its the love or guidance that they felt that change how they feel. As to your reference about testing God's power, why does it always have to be testing it this way? What difference would that make if He saved me this way or another? Would it make you a believer if you have witnessed it with your own eyes? Or would your analytical mind try to find a logical explanation to explain it? Does your divine salt shaker provides you a sense of being loved? If yes, sign me up and ill follow the Hiake's new age group. Besides, with your salt shaker, will it work every time? Same thing about the diary, by keeping one, do the ppl actually feel a complete sense of relief or is it only a temporal solution? Yes, children and adults are related and im perfectly aware of the definition of "related". However, your arguments in regards to chimps and humans dont stand. Say that it is plausible the explanation of selective evolution, then why is a pig's organ (pancreas and namely a few other parts) are more related to humans than a chimp? Does it mean that humans also evolved from yours truly Mr Porky to what we are now?
Well the same can be said for everything and everything else that does or doesn't have the same anatomy as a human/pig. Nature works in a certain way the same way gravity and elements are universal, doesn't mean god created it just because it happens to be the same.
so how does a person changing their lives have to do with god helping them just because they believe god did it / is always with them? did he come down to them in a dream or is he just magically there and you're supposed to assume he's there? oh wait i think thats really how religious people think... i can't argue against faith. i can change my life all on my own no thanks to god please.
Its easy to say nature did this and that, but why? Strictly speaking about Christianity (since i dont know too much about other religions), when one is connected to Christ, you feel a peace and love that you have never sensed before. In regards to changing, its the motivational force of His love that compels us to change, its the beauty of it. You can feel your family love but this love/ guidance that He provides, its an altogether different experience. I dont need to assume He's here, because i know He is constantly watching over all of us. Its up to you if you decide to have Him in your life or not and no one can force you to it.
1. because nature and science have at least some scientific/proof for things and is on going 2. because i can do all that without god by my side
Instead of looking at appearance and superificial features. Why not actually look at animal behaviors? Genetics only tell one side of the story. "Chimpanzees and human beings have one dramatic behavior in common: members of one social group, or troop, will seek out and kill members of a neighbouring troop, Its is a behavior that seperates us from all other mammalian species. Perhaps it is not an accident that we use the same word, 'troop', for human soldiers and to describe a group of chimpanzees."
